The only thing I find more bizarre than Fate/Zero‘s “Wikipedic” style of storytelling is the way other bloggers feel the need to disclaim their posts with statements like “Keep in mind that I haven’t watched the original series!” What difference does it make? Whether or not I’m a fan of Fate/Stay Night, having a bunch of crusty men stand around and talk my ears off about masters, servants and the Holy Grail War just isn’t my idea of entertainment. Even worse, the first episode is twice as long as your average anime episode. After thirty continuous minutes of matter-of-fact dialogue, I simply decided to throw in the towel for good.
Some might take exception with the fact that I’m writing up an episode I couldn’t even finish. Well, I’m not out here pretending to be some purely objective reviewer who will treat every anime with the same fair-minded approach. I will just write down how I feel and Fate/Zero bores me plain and simple. I don’t think I need to finish the episode to come to this conclusion either. Oh, I might have missed out on some juicy and exciting event tucked away at the end of all the chatter, but y’know what? I think I’ll live.
It’s not just the fact that the characters will converse ad nauseum. It’s actually kind of funny the way the anime goes about it. I can just imagine how one storyboarding meeting (for either the anime or the source material) might’ve gone. A director exclaims to his team, “We need movement in this scene or else the viewers will fall asleep! What can we do?”
In the corner, a meek intern stutters, “What if… they just walk around him? Like, in circles!”
“…brilliant,” cries the director, tears of joy gleaming in his eyes. “Just brilliant!”
Anyway, I’m not trying to say that anime should never contain exposition. After all, exposition is important even in real life. Whenever we immerse ourselves in a new subject or a foreign topic, there’s always that initial acclimation period to learn the new terminology and/or jargon. But y’know, this is anime; it’s not a research paper. That last statement might seem obvious at first glance, but every once in a while, it feels as though anime forgets that its goal is to entertain. An anime can have all sorts of secondary goals in mind, but the primary goal should always be to entertain.
And moving from one dry and boring conversation to the next is not my idea of entertainment. How might Fate/Zero have avoided the common pitfalls of exposition? To ask the same question in another way, how might the story have simultaneously equipped its viewers with the knowledge to understand the rest of the series and still manage to entertain? I don’t know. I’m not a storyteller, and quite frankly, it’s not my job to sit here and come up with ways to fix every anime’s problems. All I know is that I tried twice to watch the first episode and I still could not finish it.
It almost feels as though the show’s creators took the easiest way out in adapting the source material, knowing that most fans would endure the expository episode no matter what. And that makes me wonder if the show is simply created for its fans and only its fans. Well, probably not; they want as much of our money as they can get, right? If you managed to finish the first episode and liked it, then that’s great. I don’t begrudge anyone for deriving enjoyment out of most anime just because I can’t do the same. All I can really do is be honest, and Fate/Zero‘s first episode really doesn’t do it for me.
Don’t be so sure… That walking around in circles scene was apparently lifted straight from the LN, as was most everything else.
There’s probably something to be said here for the value of adaptation versus fidelity — I remember the Watchmen movie being a bit of a chore, for example, and a lot of that had to do with Zack Snyder’s painstaking recreations of comic stills in what should be a kinetic medium. I liked Fate/Zero, but I see how it could’ve used its stage more effectively.
I say “probably not” and you tell me not to be so sure!
Actually, it could be argued that Zack Snyder was commentating on ’80s action heroes with his slow-mo and whatnot, as well as poking fun at modern superhero flicks for the genre’s recent turn toward faux grittiness, but this isn’t the blog for that. As a result, I won’t
plagiarizebelabor the point.Hmm. You’re totally right, that was super unfair! Mea culpa. ;)
Now do you understand why it was hour long episode? They needed to get through this as fast as possible. The start of Fate/zero is to clue in people who haven’t read the VN. Even then it isn’t the best introduction as it still drops terms that no one is familiar with.(Unless you read the VN) Still I read the VN and when reading the light novels I too was bored with this.(Massive Type moon fan speaking) But watching it is more interesting. However, this was necessary. We now know the characters motivations, plans, etc.
Things should get much more interesting from here on. But I wouldn’t want you to blog this. I don’t want someone nitpicking what little faults it has….
Naw, that’s not good enough. Plenty of tales have extensive backstories to cover too and they don’t do so with as much clumsiness. I don’t even like The Lord of the Rings (not that I dislike the series; I just don’t care for it), but it has one of the most detailed universes of any fiction I’ve ever come across. And does The Fellowship of the Ring bore its viewers with nearly fifty straight minutes of dialogue? No. It has its own introduction, its own exposition, but it nevertheless keeps most people’s interest. So no, the way they chose to execute Fate/Zero‘s first episode was not necessary.
Well, I doubt I was going to blog this show regularly anyway, but even if I did, you wouldn’t need to read it.
“And does The Fellowship of the Ring bore its viewers with nearly fifty straight minutes of dialogue? No.”
I disagree. Yes. Yes it does. Lord of the rings is one of the only movies I ever fell asleep in the middle of. I was pretty excited to see it as well. It looked great. Then I watch it in the movie theatre and was bored to tears…so I guess I am one of those outside the “Most”
“So no, the way they chose to execute Fate/Zero‘s first episode was not necessary.”
This episode is word for word true to the novel. If they chose a different method it would only serve to infuriate the fans and not to mention would probably be inferior. Every bit of information in this episode needed to be shown. Can you think of a way to show all this info in a manner that would be better? Hows about Emiya taking down terrorists in a typical B action sequence with the words “Emiya Kiritsugu” sliding in from the side after he says a line like “Mission accomplished”….Ah no, that’s just silly. Besides it’s not as if this exposition was horrendous. While reading it in the novel wasn’t great, watching it on screen the other hand was quite enjoyable. Especially when you know what they are talking about.
So yes. It was necessary.
The Fellowship of the Ring may have bored you, and God knows The Two Towers certainly did for me, but neither movies had even remotely thirty minutes of continuous dialogue with nothing but static backgrounds to accompany its characters.
Who cares? Reasonable fans would get over it super quick as long as the adaptation is entertaining. On the plus side, you have a greater chance of attracting the people who know nothing at all about the Fate/Zero universe, but don’t quite appreciate having a Wikipedia entry read to them.
Like I’ve said, that’s not my job.
Nice strawman.
We should just agree to disagree.
“but neither movies had even remotely thirty minutes of continuous dialogue with nothing but static backgrounds to accompany its characters.”
But they did have multi million dollar budgets. Where Fate/zero does not. I would be furious if they wasted the animation budget on exposition scenes when they got many massive battle scenes to animate. But hey, that’s just me.
“Who cares? Reasonable fans would get over it super quick as long as the adaptation is entertaining.”
Yep, who cares about the target market! Besides if casual anime fans learn of what awaits them in the rest of the series then who cares about one measly exposition episode. They will jump into it faster than a dragonforce song. Considering the amount of hype this is going to get I think that if they have the internet then they will hear about it.
“Like I’ve said, that’s not my job.”
If you can’t think of anything then don’t get mad at the people for not thinking of anything.
“We should just agree to disagree.”
Now you are just making mountains out of molehills.
Haha, whatever. This right here shows just how far apart we are in our respective positions. I didn’t say I couldn’t; I just don’t to. I’m not going to sit here and brainstorm a mini-essay to fix some random anime. I posted my honest reaction to the episode and also explained why I felt the way that I did. If that’s not good enough for you, then oh well. Anyway, I’m done with this discussion; it’s going nowhere.
“Haha, whatever. This right here shows just how far apart we are in our respective positions. I didn’t say I couldn’t; I just don’t to. I’m not going to sit here and brainstorm a mini-essay to fix some random anime. I posted my honest reaction to the episode and also explained why I felt the way that I did. If that’s not good enough for you, then oh well. Anyway, I’m done with this discussion; it’s going nowhere.”
All this = Excuse. I am just asking you to back up your opinion. A sentence would suffice. I mean, it’s not like I am trying to force you to like this. I am just saying that in your opinion you think there’s an alternative method to do this episode. Yet you won’t explain what that is. Sure you don’t have to. After all it only serves to re-enforce your opinion, make it more reasonable, realistic, etc…but hey. It’s just some random anime.
Seeya.
Once again, you’re willing to be critical of a show that’s getting very lauded just about everywhere else. Given the excessive infodump nature of this episode (complete with a bunch of talking heads for most scenes) I was truly stunned by just how well-received this first episode was on most anime blogs and forums. So, once again, it’s refreshing to see somebody willing to be appropriately critical of the real flaws that a heavily hyped show has. :)
Speaking of hype, I think that’s why the Fate/Zero producers went with this approach. Simple hype would carry most viewers through the first episode, so let’s get as much of the talky stuff out of the way there as possible. That was their line of thinking, I suspect. Or I hope so, anyway, because if every episode is this talky, this anime will eventually lose me.
You’re gonna make people think I have fanboys! Of course, we’ve had plenty of disagreements in the past, but others don’t (or rather, shouldn’t) know that. In any case, I don’t know how to explain why so many people liked this episode. After all, I’m not them. In general, it’s possible to criticize an anime and still be a fan of it. A lot of people, however, seem to conflate enjoyment with quality. I mean, meatloaf is comfort food for me since I grew up with it, but I’m not blind to the fact that it’s essentially a hunk of ground meat usually slathered in syrupy sweet ketchup or BBQ sauce. Maybe the rest of Fate/Zero will be the greatest story ever told, but the first episode is still really goddamn boring.
Aroduc hated it! But… you know. He’s wonderful in a very particular way. ;)
Look at 2DT namedropping his bros.
Name-dropping a celebrity, more like. :) Everybody ought to know Aroduc and his blog.
http://tenka.seiha.org/2011/10/fatezero-01b-summoning/
I’m just an anime blogging shut-in then. What other A-listers should I know about?
EVERYTHING I’VE KNOWN HAS BEEN A LIE
i thought we were internet superstars
Naw, we’re small timers. We ain’t cool… we ain’t cool.
Hmm… Not many others last long enough, I think. But Aroduc’s an amazing blogger, incredibly consistent for years, and he translates games to boot!
He also soundly defeated me in the last Aniblog Grail War.
It was indeed a lot of exposition.. no, that’s an understatement
if i didn’t recognize 70% of the characters/families from reading the fsn novel, i think this episode would have been pretty tough to get through..
Because i read the novel though, it simply made the episode somewhat enjoyable.
I found it interesting to learn more about the people/families that were vividly referenced in the game. Even though new characters were introduced it didn’t feel completely foreign if that makes sense..
Seeing younger versions of some of the characters and contrasting was amusing too.
If the familiarity wasn’t there however, I think this episode would be unsatisfactory(if the series was an anime original for example)..
It did deliver an interesting presentation for someone like me, but in doing so it neglected its appeal to those who came in blind(ie it failed as an introduction episode).
On the bright side, this series has something going for it that we can all agree on:
people die if they are killed
Yeah I agree you need to watch or read the main series. This is just a prologue to add extra background information and what had actually happened (since you get a glimpse of the past in fate/stay night).
Nevertheless they should actually start with an action scene then went back to the talking crap.
And episodes stay deleted when I put them in the Recycle Bin!
Oh, I keed, I keed. I know you’re referencing an old Fate/Stay Night screencap.
Sometimes the episodes I’ve deleted somehow stay on my computer even after I cleared the recycle bin. Like Blue Exorcist. It’s still haunting me.
what’s goin on with my computer???
It’s haunted by the ghost of an otaku.
Yeah, the exposition was super dull even though I quite liked the premise. It seems almost unfair that the end of the episode was really exciting so I’m actually looking forward to the next episode (but it seems like you didn’t get that far!). I don’t see why they went for such similar character designs for most of the main guys though. Also, for a supposedly world-wide event over half the main cast being Japanese seemed quite strange. (Shouldn’t the church people be Italian?) I don’t mind it, but it does make the show feel less epic.
Eh, the plausibility of the story didn’t matter too much to me. I did find it strange though that a lot of the male characters had super deep voices.
fate zero is greate anime,.
Fate zero is not greate anime,.
Kind of pointless to post on this one year later and I probably won’t change your mind but I’ll say it anyway. Give this anime more of a chance. There’s a reason for it’s popularity. It has really good production values, action, suspense, mind-games, and a Machiavellian approach that will make Death Note blush. The story is written by Urobuchi Gen who is known to write unconventional dark stories and animated by ufotable with stunning quality The set up is slow at the beginning but that is because of it’s nature as a prequel. Other then that I’m not going to argue with your points or defend it viciously.
It picks up really fast afterwards with constant action and a high death toll along with morally ambiguous interesting characters (you’ll be wishing for a breather). I know the execution isn’t the best for the first episode, especially for people who couldn’t care less but the rest of the story is not dependent on the previous source material. I didn’t even watch or played Fate stay/night.
I don’t usually tell random strangers to watch an anime if they don’t like it in episode 1 but Fate/Zero is worth it. The only other anime I would go to such great lengths to do so is Steins;Gate. Give it at least a few more episodes.
I’ll tell you this though: I went into watching Fate/Zero WITHOUT knowing what the hell is going with the series. The only thing that kept me through the exposition is the animation quality and the somber atmosphere. I was rewarded with a suspenseful epic ride and came away a fan of the Fate series (then tried to watch Fate/stay night anime adaptation and fell asleep most of the time).
From one anime fan to another…please give it another shot. Even if you managed to read this much or actually finish episode 1, thanks.
Well, I read every comment I get. As to whether or not I’ll give the show a second chance, it’s just pretty unlikely. I watch a lot of current shows. Between blogging about them and my real life, it’s just hard to fit in even more anime. Sorry to disappoint you.
I understand. Thanks for the reply.
I finished Fate/Zero and man was it boring. The dialouge was litterally all about random ideals (come to think of it, don’t all the servant characters have the same ideals?), or outsmarting someone. There was nearly never a conversation when there was actual emotion: I mean like sadness, confesion, and yeah. Whenever the servant characters met each other to “fight”, they instead yaped about honor, chivalry, making me want to go in the anime and hit them. based on your feeling of the anime, I think you still wouldn’t have liked it even if you continued watching it, but hey I’m not judgeing you.